Friday, March 22, 2013

The Sin of Pride

Finntan over at Western Hero asks "Why can't we talk about race?"

The answer is because we are a country that has become too afraid to ask the hard questions, and it goes beyond race.  Sexual orientation now has a prominent place in this discussion-we're-not-allowed-to-have.  These topics are off limits, damn near taboo, because minorities are afraid of their feelings being hurt, and the rest of us are afraid of being characterized as a gang of bigots.

Equal rights movements--although they have achieved a great deal of good--are so backwards in their current forms that they are doing harm to the very people they aim to uplift.

Don't believe me?  Consider this.

Black pride and gay pride are perfectly acceptable ideas in American society.  In fact, pride in being black or gay is encounraged.

But what happens when someone stands up and says "I'm proud to be straight!"  Well of course, that man is immediately labeled an "insecure homophobe."  Someone else says "I'm proud to be a white man!"  Definitely a racist.

What is so twisted about the equal rights movements today is that they tell certain groups of people that it is okay to be proud of who they are, but simultaneously tell another group of people that it's not okay to be proud of who they are.  Racial pride: doesn't that sound a bit . . . racist?

I understand the idea behind all of this encouraged pride.  These are groups of people who have historically been marginalized and disenfranchized, so they must undo the psychological damage that has been done to them and embrace the goodness of who they are.  But if they are allowed to be proud of who they are, why am I not also allowed to be proud of who I am?

Honestly, the notion of racial pride is completely foreign to me, probably because all my life I have been taught that "white pride," always amounts to racism (justifiably so, because that is how it manifested itself historically).  But what about pride in my gender or sexual orientation?  I simply do not find any reason to be proud of the fact that I like women.

Race relations will never move forward in this country so long as there is an air of pride and entitlement placed on some groups, and shame and guilt are imposed on everyone else.  It is a complete logical fallacy to say that "race shouldn't matter," but at the same time teach people that race does, in fact, matter.  If race shouldn't matter, then why does Affirmative Action exist?

Furthermore, the unspoken tension will exist perpetually so long as we, as a society, shun those who try to ask the hard questions and try to have the uncomfortable discussions.  Here's the first question: why is it okay to be proud of being black, but it's racist to be proud of being white?

You know what I'm proud of?  I'm proud of the fact that I served my country honorably.  I'm proud of the fact that I was a pretty damn good cryptologist in my day.

I'm proud that I'm raising two beautiful and intelligent children.  I'm proud that I graduated with a double major in history and political science summa cum laude.  I'm proud of the fact that I help people with disabilities be productive on their jobs so that they can maintain employment and live fuller lives.

I'm proud of my accomplishments; not my skin color, not of my preference for women, and not because of my downstairs mixup.  Yes, I'm proud of who I am, but I'm not proud of my genetics.  I'm not ashamed of my genetics either.  It's inconsequential because I had no control over it.  What I am proud of is the person I've become over the years.

Perhaps if everyone was taught that their skin color, sexual orientation, and gender actually don't matter, then perhaps the concept of "race relations," could finally be relegated to a vocabulary word in a social studies text book--an antiquated philosophical construct of an unevolved iteration of the human species.

25 comments:

Jersey McJones said...

"Perhaps if everyone was taught that their skin color, sexual orientation, and gender actually don't matter, then perhaps the concept of "race relations," could finally be relegated to a vocabulary word in a social studies text book--an antiquated philosophical construct of an unevolved iteration of the human species."

Well, unfortunately, for the time being these things do matter and it looks like it will be quite a while until they don't.

So, while you're DNA is just a matter of the luck of the draw, it remains a strong indicator of what your "accomplishments" can be.

I'm not sure why you brought up the Black Pride movement here, as it's apex was back in the 60's and 70's. The Gay Pride movement is a little more contemporary.

It's not that it's bad to be proud of your Western heritage, but rather just unnecessary, piling it on, so to speak. Just like being proud of being straight. It's like being proud of having good eyesight or all your limbs. It's being proud of being lucky, not exactly something to be proud of.

The white man still has a lot of advantages over minorities and women in America.

JMJ

Ducky's here said...

But what happens when someone stands up and says "I'm proud to be straight!" Well of course, that man is immediately labeled an "insecure homophobe." Someone else says "I'm proud to be a white man!" Definitely a racist.

-----
No, just a whining little child.

Look, if you can come up with any era in American history where society taught white men to be ashamed of themselves, let us know.

Otherwise, whiny little kid.

Anonymous said...

Wow.

That's just too easy ducky, you immediately walked straight into his argument and proved him correct.

Don't believe me? Read it again.

So how about your lifetime as an answer?


As to Jersey, I don't have anything to really debate until the last sentence. I too think it will take time due to the unwillingness of people to change or the incapability to change.

Truth is, just being born as a healthy human is unfathomable luck from a big picture standpoint.

So when does it end? If white males still have the advantage per you? Under what parameters is equality achieved.

My personal opinion is equality is achieved when all situations work and flow in reverse. Living in a somewhat bad neighborhood, I have been called everything from a nazi to a cracker and everything in between by different ethnicities. In my area, I am the minority. A white man.

On the flip side, my immediate neighbors who are african-american on one side and puerto rican on the other, have been excellent neighbors and are friendly. We help each other out here and there and it's great.

So who am I expected to feel sorry for? The cool people that have their shit together and don't sling hatred at me (at least to my face) or the people that won't even engage me in conversation without spewing vitriol?

Jack Camwell said...

Ducky,

I usually regard you as intelligent, but I am a little taken aback at the fact that you basically proved my point.

It's totally permissible to be proud of being black, or gay, or a woman. But if you're proud of being white, or straight, or a man, then one is considered to be a "whiny little kid."

Perhaps you missed the hypothetical nature of the scenario? Perhaps you missed the part where I said that NO ONE should be proud of what they were born to be--that we should all regard that as a neutral fact of life deserving neither pride nor shame. But whatever, I guess.

And RIGHT NOW is an era where society is being taught that being a straight white male is something to be ashamed of--or at least we're not allowed to be proud of it.

Minorities are taught that they should be proud of who they are, and everyone else is taught that they have no right to be proud of who they are. It's implicit in our culture.

The Smoking Man said...

"Look, if you can come up with any era in American history where society taught white men to be ashamed of themselves, let us know."

I damn near spit my drink out when I read that. When it comes to being ashamed of being a white male, there is no time like the present.

You have confirmed that by stating directly afterward that the grievances of this entire group of people constitutes nothing more than being "whining little child[ren]."

TSM

Jack Camwell said...

Thank you for stopping by TSM (and not just because you happen to agree with me).

=)

Jersey McJones said...

Jack, just who, and how exactly, is anyone abusing you for being a white guy? Do you think your average inner-city black kid would feel any more secure walking through a white neighborhood than you through theirs?

We have race problems in America, they seem to be slowly improving over time, but some people are always uncomfortable with change, and some people are just assholes. Some people feel threatened by the rise of other people around them.

But the white man in America has never suffered anything close to what he has imposed on other Americans. Never. Spoiled brats.

JMJ

Jack Camwell said...

Who the hell said that what is going on now is comparable to what happened to blacks in America? Pretty sure I didn't even so much as allude to that.

This isn't about abuse, this is about moving forward. My position is that we can't move forward so long as the notion of racial pride (or pride in one's sexual orientation) goes away completely.

And I'm also arguing that the notion that straight white men aren't allowed to be proud of being straight white men, while others are encouraged to be proud of who they are, is preventing race relations from moving forward.

The notion of racial pride foments insecurity. You even said it yourself the other day. When I asked "what if I stood up and said I'm proud to be straight," you said that someone like that would be "insecure."

So only white men who are proud of being white are insecure, while black men who are proud of being black are just fine?

Have you ever considered that the reason race relations are so fucked up today is because people WANT race relations to be fucked up?

Take Black History Month for example. Isn't it odd that we relegate black history to ONE MONTH in the year rather than saying "you know what, black history is a part of American history, and it should be treated as integral rather than a niche subject"?

It pleases the hell out of a lot of people, but those with half a brain realize it's a way to keep blacks and whites perpetually separate.

And with racial pride, it keeps minority races in America insecure. They're worried that if they don't extol their pride, they will fall back into being oppressed.

Keep the people scared, keep the people ignorant, and keep the people happy: that's how the status quo is maintained.

Anonymous said...

Jersey... I have never owned a slave, but regardless it's cool when black people make fun of me for absolutely no other reason than I am white. They are allowed. They get a pass. They can call me honky cracker inbred redneck sheepfucker all day long. They can be flatout racist towards me, without fear of any real consequences.

That is the problem, in a nutshell.

Trayvon Martin's murder is a hate crime, but Channon Christian and Chris Newsom being abducted for days, gangraped, sodomized, castrated, lit on fire, and tortured to death... that's not a hate crime... nosiree, that's just plain ol justice.

Chris Rock goes on stage, says "nigga" 120 times an hour, no one bats an eye. I say that one time to someone harassing me where I live, I instantly escalate a situation rapidly going toward violence.

I am not suggesting Chris Rock should modify his behavior, and I am not suggesting I get Carte Blanche to disparage people of any other race. What I am suggesting is that we equalize the consequences for hate, in all it's forms, then this shit can really go away.





Jersey McJones said...

Zimmerman has not been charged with a hate crime. Get your facts straight.

Equalizing the consequences of racism is exactly why we have hate crime laws.

And Jack, again, the superfluous display of "white pride" would just be salt on wounds. Race relations are hindered by some people who just don't understand that.

JMJ

Anonymous said...

That's all you gleaned from that?

Fair enough. The FBI had it on the table for quite sometime, and many people have labelled it as such in the media, the comment was more of making an example of a "1+1=3" scenario than citing fact. Perhaps "People wanted" should have prefaced that paragraph. For clarification.

Also you dodged the second part of that. You think that young couple's brutal murder is less of a hate crime?

There is NO LAW against calling me a cracker. Get your facts straight too. I wasn't talking about the law in that sense, I was talking about general idea. Hate speech, that is GENUINE hate speech, should be frowned upon regardless who or what is saying it and who is it's target. Yet it is socially acceptable for anyone to call me whatever the hell they want.

All I am saying, and maybe you are not on board with this, is when people cry wolf constantly, the Shepherds of Liberty start feeling resentment.

Jackie isn't advocating white pride.

It is really as simple as letting go. Let go of all the pretense and all the gimmicks trying raise them up "to our level." They are already on our level, they just need to drop their own bullshit and we need to drop ours. That is unlikely to happen in our lifetime, probably due to the salt you alluded to.

If I got a job/scholarship I knew in my heart I didn't deserve because of some dumb ass law saying they had to hire me, or give me money that would stick with me, even subconsciously.

We all come from the same place, let's start acting like it... and that is not a one way, whites only have to behave mandate.

Silverfiddle said...

@ Jersey: "So, while you're DNA is just a matter of the luck of the draw, it remains a strong indicator of what your "accomplishments" can be."

Deterministic bullshit.

It is this paternalistic, progressive "soft bigotry of low expectations" that keeps people down.

Our nation abounds with examples of how poor minority children can reach the highest levels of academic achievement if just given a chance by teachers who demand nothing but the best from them.

Progressives vote harvesters do the opposite. But what can we expect from a group that worships racist eugenicist Margaret Sanger, and cheer on he endowment's (Planned Parenthood) continuing crusade to pull society's weeds.

Spitting in the Eye of Mainstream Education

KP said...

Jack, solid article. Very solid supportive posts.

Jersey McJones said...

Silver, you need to get out more. The only determinism here is that of those in power to keep down those they fear will usurp it. Spoiled, whiny white men clinging to power.

JMJ

Anonymous said...

Ahh, so now the truth comes out eh?

Let it be known that Jersey want's equality for all but white men.

You didn't even say "No Racist" that's impressive to be that firmly rooted.

To me, here is what you have been saying in these last couple blog entries, clarify please if this is off the mark.

"Only whites can be racist and only men can be sexist. We need social programs in place to prop up women and minorities because they lack the ability to achieve on their own due to the whites and men in general being at the helm since always."

From what I have read, it is you that has the lower opinion of these people, that we must hold women and minorities with kid gloves or else they will fall and be shattered.

Has it ever occurred to you that the reason there is this "gap"(loose term) between women and men, whites and minorities is because they are basically told their particular demographic desperately needs help, or that they are so screwed they need government favors, or whatever the case may be?

Mindy B. said...

Where was everyone when Obama was appointing a Lesbian to the Supreme Court?
It’s worth highlighting that Kagan has also taken actions in her SG capacity that operate to undermine Don’t Ask, Don’t Tell and the Defense of Marriage Act.
Whenever you have any one pushing their agendas and lifestyles upon the people or the United States, it is our business. She will be pushing Gay agendas from the supreme court. That is our business. I think we have had enough break down of the family already. Do we need a supreme court to further its downfall?
If she was gay, and never pushed it in her issues and debates in the public, there would be no issue. But she is a avid pro gay supporter and endorser.
Obama’s controversial appointments, not only to the federal bench, but to key cabinet positions, as well as to the unaccountable (and probably unconstitutional) “Czar” positions. So much of the criticism has been on the Obama administration’s lack of vetting when filling these rolls—but that’s not the issue today, is it. I don’t believe in Gay Marriage and I am shocked that our president would support this at all.
All of a sudden this gaggle is concerned about the Constitution . . . where were they when Obamacare was shoved up our backsides?
I feel that marriage should be between a man and a woman. Obama is weak and only governs from the polls. In the eyes of God marriage is sacred and sacred it shall remain forever.
I have nothing against gay people but I AM not a fan of gay marriage. As for President Obama, he doesn’t speak for all Americans, he only speaks for himself and the poor misled souls who elected him.

Jack Camwell said...

Thank you for your comments and sharing your concerns Mindy.

I don't see anyone really pushing the gay lifestyle on anyone, at least not in the sense that people are trying to turn people gay.

Sure, they might be pushing the notion that being gay is okay--and there is something to be said for that being a bit ridiculous--but the struggle, in my eyes, is simply to make sure that gay men and women are not treated like second class citizens.

Personally, I don't think being gay is immoral. I think dude-on-dude action is pretty gross, but I've always said that just because I find something gross doesn't make it immoral.

And as far as the breakdown of the family unit, is that not a lifestyle choice? So long as a child's parents are loving and supportive of their child, should it really matter whether or not they're straight or gay? I would say not.

And as for the moral implications, there are plenty of horrible things that the bible condones, yet after time we've figured out that basing our morality on a 2,000 year old text is not always the best way to go about things.

If we followed the bible to the T, we'd still have legalized slavery, and men would still be allowed to beat their wives.

Jersey McJones said...

Anon,

This is just stupid:

"Let it be known that Jersey want's equality for all but white men."

I mean, really. What kind of stupid thing is that to say? Just what level of stupid are you coming from there?

And this is a stupid, stupid, stupid misrepresentation:

"Only whites can be racist and only men can be sexist. We need social programs in place to prop up women and minorities because they lack the ability to achieve on their own due to the whites and men in general being at the helm since always."

And this is sleazy below belief:

"From what I have read, it is you that has the lower opinion of these people, that we must hold women and minorities with kid gloves or else they will fall and be shattered."

I do not think in any way that you seem to understand. I do not believe anyone needs a leg up over anyone else. Nor does any sane, reasonably intelligent American I know. And people like me do not believe minorities and women are political beggars, or at least no more or less than white men.

Women and minorities do not vote Democrat, for example, because they want something they do not deserve any more than white men. In fact, white men are by far the most politically influential.

Women and minorities vote that way because they see Republican politicians as sleazy, selfish, demagogues who do not care about minorities and women, or the common, working man, productive well beyond his pay.

Those Republican white men, those who bitch about everyone other person bitching, think only of themselves and will rationalize the morality of their wants to the point of insanity.

And finally, minorities and women are bitching for a reason. A real, ubiquitous, historic, ongoing reason.

Sometimes the bitching may get annoying, or inconvenient for some, but usually it's only because some people are a little personally insecure or uncomfortable for some reason, or they blame the wrong people for the wrong reasons to vainly rationalize some evidently wrong ideology.

JMJ

The Smoking Man said...

"I have nothing against gay people but I AM not a fan of gay marriage."

Okay Mindy B, I get what you are saying. Gay people don't bother you, it's just when they do gay things, even in private, that you are bothered.

Wait a second. It seems like gay people DO in fact bother you. Perhaps it is time for you to "come out of the closet", as they say. I'm here, I'm a bigot, get used to it!

TSM

The Smoking Man said...

"Those Republican white men, those who bitch about everyone other person bitching, think only of themselves and will rationalize the morality of their wants to the point of insanity."

I should point out, just in case, that you'd be a damned fool to not realize that this same statement is equally true for Democrat politicians, white males or otherwise.

Jack Camwell said...

Jersey, get ONE THING through your skull:

No one here is insecure. I know that your overlords tell you to think that we're somehow insecure, but I can assure you that is the case.

This isn't about power or influence, Jersey. This is about the fact that the equal rights movements of today are actually doing more to HURT the minorities they speak for rather than to help them.

We are talking about why they are unsuccessful, and how if they remain the same then poor race relations will continue, and true equal rights will never, ever be achieved.

I believe, in my heart of hearts, that this harm that equal rights movements are doing to minorities is purposeful.

What you fail to see is that by providing preferential treatment to people based on race, gender, and sexual orientation, it is tantamount to telling them that they ARE indeed worthless, that the white man is still trying to keep them down (which is generally not the case), and that they cannot be successful on their own merits.

Race quotas legit exist, Jersey, and it's completely retarded. If you're black and not as qualified as a white man to do a particular job, then sorry, but go find another line of work.

We're not talking about white power Jersey. As soon as you can get it through your brainwashed skull that we're talking about the unintended negative consequences of modern equal rights movements, THEN you'll be able to actually meaningfully engage in the discussion.

If you disagree with someone someone says, STOP ACTING LIKE A FUCKING CHILD ABOUT IT. Instead of saying "that's just STUPID STUPID STUPID," like a whiney kid, then how about you do what I do:

Break down the logicality of someone's argument and show them how their thinking is not well reasoned.

Holy fucking God Jersey, perhaps calling people and their arguments STUPID passes on other blogs, but here I ask that you take a more intellectual and academic approach.

Jersey McJones said...

His argument was stupid, Jack. It's not that he's stupid. He was smart enough to come up with that sleazy bait 'n switch in the first place - like the sleazy bait n' switch that somehow programs to make life more opportune for women and minorities somehow harm them.

And yes, it is insecurity. Why else would a class of people who have everything bitch and moan about classes that have less?

JMJ

Jack Camwell said...

And once again, I invite you to read our arguments, and you would see that we're actually advocating for real change and REAL equality.

The whole premise is that equal rights movements today are HINDERING race relations progressl.

Read.

It.

Again.

Anonymous said...

I concur with Jackie's sentiments.

"Sometimes the truth may get annoying, or inconvenient for some, but usually it's only because some people are a little personally insecure or uncomfortable for some reason, or they blame the wrong people for the wrong reasons to vainly rationalize some evidently wrong ideology."

FTFY Jersey. You can keep the "change".

Here is my vision of how you can get real equality faster and less painfully. It's so simple.

Take everything the government and legal system does to prop up / support / hand-out / spoon feed women and minorities and completely throw it all the hell away.

In 25 years when all the racist and sexist shitbags die out or they are exposed in the light for all to see long enough they retreat to their vampire castles never to feast again on their own prejudice.

Generation Y, will omnislash all who oppose liberty, because we are tired of this shit. I am 31 years old and I am tired of all the shit we have to shovel for the government. The whole thing is a sham, a mismanaged sham.

We grew up with shows like Star Trek TNG, lived in a world where there was no ¡bigbadass!­© opposing superpower, have seen the value of our currency fucking EVAPORATE faster than we can fill up the tank, and we have far less debt because we weren't lulled to sleep and bought shit we couldn't afford, we have listened to these fucking shills give us a line of bullshit run-around creating a mess we will have to clean up.

The first President to take office that was born within 1981 to 1990 is very likely to agree with me, and unless the presidency is just a placeholder for some secret oligarchy and we are all living in the shadows of the Rothschilds or something similar, he/she will have all the pent up raging emotional firepower to bust all this bullshit wide open.

I want a president who comes straight out and says it. "We are completely fucked and unless we do something right now the entire country will go directly to hell and owe, not collect, 200 trillion dollars and languish in a prison of our own design until our demise. This country will only be remembered as a complete and utter catastrophe that prompted it's own immolation with a self-inflicted incendiary airburst to the temple. In the annuls of future historian's essays, you will read how the mighty fell so far, how the american dream turned into the american nightmare, and how desperate they became at the realization they were their own worst enemies."

I want the president to use that exact language to drive home the fact we are Harold Lloyd, about to lose his grip on the clock hands and we have to give up this and grab the fucking rope, then burn this tinderbox of an empire to the ground.

Defend our borders, defend our liberty, defend our currency, defend our true friends. The rest will sort itself out because it must.

Steve Finnell said...

PRIDE IS THE ERADICATOR OF INTELLECT

Pride can cause you to appear intellectually challenged. The devil had a pride problem. The devil knew that Jesus was God in the flesh, and he still tried to tempt Jesus to sin. [Matthew 4:1-11]

PRIDE CAN CAUSE YOU TO APPEAR INTELLECTUALLY CHALLENGED.

Pride destroys the faculty for understanding.

Pride hinders the power of discernment.

Pride is a road-block to clear thinking.

Pride clouds our judgment.

Pride restricts our comprehension.

Pride causes us to think we are smarter than God.

Pride opens the avenue for us to believe man-made doctrine.

2 Peter 3:16 as also in all his letters, speaking in them of these things , in which are some things hard to understand, which the untaught and unstable distort, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction.

Pride renders men unteachable and unstable and causes them to distort the truth, and believe the false doctrine of others, to their own destruction.

When we study God's word relying on our own understanding; rather than asking God to show us HIS truth we become a victim of are own pride.

Proverbs 3:5-7 Trust in the Lord with all your heart And do not lean on your own understanding. 6 In all ways acknowledge Him, And He will make your paths straight. 7 Do not be wise in your own eyes. Fear the Lord and turn away from evil.

DO NOT BE WISE IN YOUR OWN EYES.

PRIDE IS THE ERADICATOR OF INTELLECT!

(All Scripture quotes from: NEW AMERICAN STANDARD BIBLE)


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